« Obama's New Politics, Exemplified | Main | Is Comedy Central Breaking The Law? A Second View »

Scott Rasmussen : The Elites Versus The Activists

26 Oct 2007 11:07 am

One of the more fascinating manifestations of the split between the elite press and the newer media is in how they treat the robotic (or automated) polls of Scott Rasmussen . Mr. Rasmussen uses a variety of screens and can poll so often and so cheaply because he does not use humans to ask the questions. A computer-generated questioner interacts with the voter, who presses the corresponding button a touch-tone phone.

The press -- and the pollsters who consult for them and most campaign pollsters -- dismiss Rasmussen out of hand. For the latter group, there may be an element of competitive jealousy in the mix, but there are also valid reasons to be skeptical about screening and sample bias in automated surveys and contact and cooperation rates with voters. Democrats in particular tend to be skeptical because Rasmussen is a conservative.

For conservative activists, they are the equivalent of crack, and much, much less deadly.

Occasionally, the campaigns whose pollsters denigrate Mr. Rasmussen's polls often drop their skepticism and cite them when those polls bounce in a positive direction.

Yesterday, Fred Thompson's press shop issued a release with the headline: "Thompson Tied for First in National Poll; Giuliani in Free Fall."

While Fred Thompson travels the nation with his message of consistent conservatism and touts his border security and immigration reform proposal, a recent national tracking poll shows that Thompson has pulled into a virtual tie with Rudy Giuliani. This poll further shows that Rudy has lost almost a third of his support in the last 12 days. (Margin of error is +/- 4 percent)

The source for these numbers is a Rasmussen survey.

This press release was clearly not intended for those of us who work for established publications.

It was aimed at the newer generation of opinion leaders.

But if and when anyone from Thompson's team ever dumps on the Rasmussen robots, I will be the first to let you know.

Fun fact: Scott Rasmussen is a co-founder of ESPN.

Comments (19)

The problem with Rasmussen isn't that he uses automated calling. SurveyUSA does the same, and no one has a problem.

The problem with Rasmussen is that he is, as you mention, a conservative, and that this seems to affect his methodology. He consistently gets a right-ward bias in his numbers, compared to all the other pollsters.

In short, he's got an ideological agenda, and his numbers are consistently an outlier in that ideological direction. Questions of intellectual honesty are thus raised.

All that said, his daily tracking numbers are useful, since even if his methodology skews right-ward, it is consistent from day to day.

But the real question is, "are his polls accurate?" He has some track record (and it seems like it is fairly good).

The other thing that he seems to be bringing to the table is that he is one of the few pollsters who are trying to figure out who are likely primary voters rather than just registered voters or likely general election voters.

"The other thing that he seems to be bringing to the table is that he is one of the few pollsters who are trying to figure out who are likely primary voters rather than just registered voters or likely general election voters."

This isn't true.

"But the real question is, "are his polls accurate?" He has some track record (and it seems like it is fairly good)."

The question isn't "are his polls accurate" since there's no verification possible. The polls a day before the election can be "accurate" and still not correctly predict the election result, given that elections tend to break one way or another at the end.

The question is that his polls are consistently an outlier from other polls, and given that they consistently outlie the norm in the same direction as his personal politics, can conclusions be reached that his methodology is affected by his ideology.

Anyone know how accurate Rasmussen was on the last presidential election?

"The problem with Rasmussen is that he is, as you mention, a conservative, and that this seems to affect his methodology. He consistently gets a right-ward bias in his numbers, compared to all the other pollsters."

Of course, the thought that "all the other pollsters" methodology could be biased never occured to you just as all other MSM is correctly balanced in their reporting where FOX leans right, RIGHT!? LMHO!


C'mon! you have to be working too hard at be this dense.

Yes Rasmussen is a conservative... but how 'bout that Zogby... he's over their stage left of Nancy Pelosi... he hates the GOP... but I haven't seen any knocks on that guy.

One thing about Rasmussen polling that sets it appart is it identifies voters likely to vote in the primaries... and with the majority of voters in this country not voting period... let alone in the primaries... this is a much more accurate way to determine who may get the nomination.

By the way... today Giuliani has dropped another point.

Go Fred - Beat Hillary!
http://www.FRedStates.com

All I care about is whether his final poll predicts the election results correctly.....

Petey,

You say that my assertion about Rasmussen's sampling is not true. What part is not true? I did a quick look at RealClearPolitics and found the following:

Insider Advantage uses "Likely Voters"
CBS uses "Likely Primary Voters"
Fox uses both "Registered Voters" and "Likely Voters"
Quinnipiac and Cook both use "Registered Voters"

So the only one that is trying to do what Rasmussen is doing is CBS.

Understanding that there are "breaks" at the election, you can easily use the most recent poll prior to the election to decide how accurate the polling group is. You do the exact same thing with your weatherman. There are strange variables that affect the end result, but you want to know which weatherman to listen to on the 11 o'clock news to have the best idea of what will happen tomorrow. THAT is what I want to know.

The polling group that was doing the 2004 exit polling should not be used by anyone because they are fundamentally not good.

Rasmussen has published his scorecard for the 2006 election at

http://legacy.rasmussenreports.com/MembersOnly/2006%20State%20Polls/senateElection2006Scoreboard.htm

and

http://legacy.rasmussenreports.com/MembersOnly/2006%20State%20Polls/governorScoreboard.htm

I wish others would do the same.

It is time for all MILITARY VETERANS to get on board with Fred Thompson. Sign up at:

http://Vets4Fred.net

Joel,

There are many more major pollsters than the ones you've named, a substantial number of which poll for LV's.

Petey... how can Rasmussen skew right when we're talking about just GOP candidates... it's not yet a left vs right thing... UNLESS you are saying Fred is the only real conservative? If you're saying that then I'm probably with you 100%.

Petey,

First, Likely Voters are different than Likely Primary Voters.

Second, my liking of Rasmussen is that it appears to me that he is a more accurate poller than most of the others. I define accuracy as best anticipating what happens on election day.

If he is an outlier, then either he is inaccurate, or he is doing something right that the others are not. So far the numbers that I have seen indicate that he is doing a better job of accurately predicting the actual elections than the other polling institutions.

How about thinking about it another way: if I was a candidate for elective office, which would I rather have: a polling company that agrees with my political leanings that generates inaccurate polling results (with the excuse that everything breaks on the last day) OR one who disagrees with my political leanings that actually predicts the election accurately?

"Second, my liking of Rasmussen is that it appears to me that he is a more accurate poller than most of the others. I define accuracy as best anticipating what happens on election day."

Pollsters with a Republican skew did best in the '04 Presidential race because that's the direction the race broke at the end.

Pollsters with a Democratic skew did best in the '00 Presidential race because that's the direction the race broke at the end.

Rasmussen is a consistent Republican outlier, which matches his personal ideological outlook. Nothing wrong with that - there are plenty of other pollsters with an ideological skew on both sides of the aisle, as well as some more non-partisan pollsters who are a bit more useful.

So nothing wrong with it. But it is what it is.

How about 2006? It ran quite Democratic, but reviewing Rasmussen's numbers reveal that he did very well in 2006.

Rasmussen's poll was quite accurate with the Presidential Election results in 2004. Here's a quote from Rasmussen's site from Saturday, January 01, 2005:

"President George W. Bush won the popular vote on November 2 by a 50.7% to 48.2% margin over Senator John Kerry. The final Rasmussen Reports projection had shown the President winning 50.2% to 48.5%."

You can view the whole page at:
http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/presidential_tracking_poll_bush_kerry

Former Senator Fred Thompson is the only candidate that gets it. He makes decisions based on principles. Principles don’t change. You have to stand for something and not change who you are based on the polls. That is what Mitt Romney and Rudy Giuliani have done and all of the Democrats do it. Give me a leader that will stand by his principles anyday versus someone that stands for everything.

I know many Republicans and conservatives that will stay home if Rudy Giuliani is the candidate. He does not represent our values as conservatives, and never will. Millionaire Mitt Romney is a Republican-in-name-only (RINO ) that simply has everything else and nothing to do. “I guess I’ll just try to buy the presidency”. The White House isn’t for sale! Conservatives will simply stay home and the Democrats will pick up additional seats in the House and probably get the 60 seats in the Senate they need to completely destroy our Country. Nice picture huh?

However, I think Fred can bring America back together, if that’s even possible. America needs a rebirth of patriotism and honor. Republicans also need a rebirth. President Reagan was our last rebirth and he can never be duplicated. Fred Thompson will bring his own down-to-earth common sense to this country. If a conservative runs as a conservative, he will win!

Think of it this way: Eight years of another Clinton White House? Now if that is not a sufficient enough reason to pull together as a nation, and fight this socialist liberal takeover of our government, what is?

Folks, we are in for the fight of our lives, just as our young men and women are fighting for our freedoms in Iraq and Afghanistan, we must fight for our nation right here and now! I truly believe Fred Thompson is the one man who can pull this nation back together! Rudy Giuliani will just tear us apart.

Contribute to Fred Thompson: https://www.fred08.com/contribute.aspx?RefererID=c637caaa-315c-4b4c-9967-08d864cd0791

This is a copy of a reply sent to the Atlantic a few weeks ago from our national director, Richard Holt of Thinkcondi.net and as far as I know, it has never been published.

It is in reply to the Grand Illusions of May 2007 about Sec. Condi Rice.

It belongs on the Atlantic Monthly blog since it is in referral to a story by the magazine.

Regarding the June issue cover story,
"Last chance" implies correctly
that Secretary of State Condi Rice has a short time left with the Bush
Administration to create the "grand deal" for the Middle East. Yet, as
of
June, credit should be given to her strategy of "clear, hold, and build"
which has started to work in the Tal Afar region of Iraq. It is one
example of her influence in setting strategy with Secretary Robert Gates
at the Pentagon to normalize the nation.

After 40 years of repression under the Saddam's barbaric regime, it is
understandable that building confidence in the minds of newly freed men
will not happen quickly. In years past, even the verbal remarks against
Saddam was enough to get a man, his wife or his children killed.
Therefore, as the Arab nations step forward to help train Iraqi men as
soldiers and police officers, it will take time for them to gain the
courage and bravery needed to fight in protecting the new Iraqi nation
rather than cower in fear of death.

Writer David Samuels created an excellent portrayal of how Madam Secretary
made an "end run" around VP Cheney on foreign policy with North Korea. Her
action clearly shows she is the most powerful woman in America deserving
full credit for dragging the dictator back to the 6-party talks. During
the past year, Madam Secretary invested weeks of her time on "shuttle
diplomacy" making numerous visits to Russia, Japan, S Korea and China to
unite in responding to this international crisis; placing economic and
humanitarian pressure upon the N Korea government. Her "statescraft"
fingerprints are on the deal and holding discussions with her
representative Nicholas Burns in how to manage it.

I disagree that President Bush was overshadowing his top diplomat
during the Quartet meeting with his phone call to Israel's PM Olmert to
maintain a diplomatic freeze. Rather, that he stood by his loyal
Secretary of State's own statement: "you can not have one foot in politics
and the other foot in terrorism." Standing up to Hamas exposes how they
must not be seen as passing laws during the day and assassinating people
at night. The President supports her as the face of our nation to the
world.

May I offer you an example of how a Cabinet minister can undermine the
leadership of her nation? PM Olmert of Israel is under threat of being
booted out of office by his foreign minister, Tzipi Livni,who is seeking
to take over their political party and the prime minister's seat. I think
President Bush is lucky to have a team player standing by his side on the
international stage to help him succeed in his final months rather having
to watch his back. Teamwork of Bush/Condi could become the true legacy of
the Bush Administration and the future of our nation.

Pulse Opinion Research
Iowa
Survey of 1,000 Likely Voters
October 23, 2007

1* I'd like you to compare two Presidential tickets. The first ticket is Hillary Clinton as President and an unidentified Southern male as Vice President. The second ticket is Al Gore as President and Barack Obama as Vice President.

Would a Clinton Presidency be more effective, equally effective, or less effective than a Gore-Obama Presidency at securing global cooperation on climate change with India, China, and Russia?

14% More effective
26% Equally effective
41% Less effective
19% Not sure

2* Is a Clinton White House more likely, equally likely, or less likely than a Gore-Obama White House to invade Iran without reason?

16% More likely
40% Equally likely
23% Less likely
20% Not sure

3*Great, is a Clinton Presidency more likely, equally likely, or less likely than a Gore-Obama Presidency to shut down detainee facilities in Guantanamo Bay?

17% More likely
48% Equally likely
14% Less likely
21% Not sure

4* Does a Gore-Obama Presidency have a better chance, equal chance or a worse chance than a Clinton Presidency of reducing global proliferation of loose nuclear weapons?

26% Better chance
43% Equal chance
12% Worse chance
18% Not sure

5* Fine, is a Gore-Obama Presidency more willing, equally willing, or less willing than a Clinton Presidency to risk alienating special interests by reforming Social Security?

23% More willing
42% Equally willing
13% Less willing
23% Not sure

6* Is a Gore-Obama Presidency more likely, equally likely, or less likely than a Clinton Presidency to reduce American dependence on foreign oil?

35% More likely
36% Equally likely
12% Less likely
17% Not sure

7*Okay, would a Gore-Obama Presidency be better, worse, or just as good as a Clinton Presidency for the environment?

46% Better
14% Worse
27% Just as good
14% Not sure

8* Is a Gore-Obama Presidency more likely, equally likely, or less likely than a Clinton Presidency to reduce the total number of abortions in the United States?

12% More likely
53% Equally likely
13% Less likely
22% Not sure

9* Next, would a Clinton Presidency have a greater chance, an equal chance, or a lesser chance than a Gore-Obama Presidency of changing America for the better?

19% Greater chance
36% Equal chance
29% Lesser chance
16% Not sure


10* Is Al Gore less honest, more honest or just as honest as Hillary Clinton?

31% More honest
14% Less honest
43% Just as honest
13% Not sure

NOTE: Margin of Sampling Error, +/- 3 percentage points with a 95% level of confidence

The telephone survey of 1,000 Likely Voters was conducted by Pulse Opinion Research on October 23, 2007. Pulse Opinion Research, LLC is an independent public opinion research firm using automated polling methodology and procedures licensed from Rasmussen Reports, LLC.

Rasmussen is perhaps the most accurate national pollster at this point. The MSM polls have been using adults and registered voters for the most part which puts a dramatic leftward skew in the Republican Primary results. Further, when they do use likely voter screening questions they weight to census data which again puts a leftward skew in the data. The weights are an art form and allow skewing even with likely voters screens.

The MSM press polls are over stating Rudy's support by 5 to 10 points consistently. ARG tends to track Rasmussen, Zogby also tends to track Rasmussen but with a little more left skew.

Further, Rasmussen sells his information to subscribers. He gets paid to be accurate. The MSM polls reflect the MSM agenda of creating news and trying to manipulate the nomination. Fox is one of the worst offenders, CBS and Gallup/USA (have not been using their own 7 question likely voter screen) are also bad. They can be very accurate when they are up against an election. However, right now they are busy trying to hand the election to Rudy with biased polling results that they use for news coverage.


Copyright © 2008 by The Atlantic Monthly Group. All rights reserved.