BLITZER: All right. I want to just press you on this point, because it's a logical follow-up, and then I want to go and ask everyone.On the issue that apparently tripped up Senator Clinton earlier, the issue of driver's licenses for illegal immigrants, I take it, Senator Obama, you support giving driver's licenses to illegal immigrants.
Is that right?
OBAMA: When I was a state senator in Illinois, I voted to require that illegal aliens get trained, get a license, get insurance to protect public safety. That was my intention.
(APPLAUSE)
And -- but I have to make sure that people understand. The problem we have here is not driver's licenses. Undocumented workers do not come here to drive.
(LAUGHTER)
They don't go -- they're not coming here to go to the In-N-Out Burger. That's not the reason they're here. They're here to work.
And so instead of being distracting by what has now become a wedge issue, let's focus on actually solving the problem that this administration, the Bush administration, had done nothing about it.
BLITZER: Well, let's go through everybody because I want to be precise. I want to make sure the viewers and those of us who are here fully understand all of your positions on this barring -- avoiding, assuming -- there isn't going to be comprehensive immigration reform.
Do you support or oppose driver's licenses for illegal immigrants?
OBAMA: I am not proposing that that's what we do.
OBAMA: What I'm saying is that we can't...(LAUGHTER)
No, no, no, no. Look, I have already said, I support the notion that we have to deal with public safety and that driver's licenses at the same level can make that happen.
But what I also know...
BLITZER: All right...
OBAMA: But what I also know, Wolf, is that if we keep on getting distracted by this problem, then we are not solving it.
BLITZER: But -- because this is the kind of question that is sort of available for a yes or no answer.
(LAUGHTER)
Either you support it or you oppose it.
(APPLAUSE)
« The Iran Question | Main | In Case You Missed It... » Here's The Full Transcript Of The Exchange On Immigration15 Nov 2007 09:28 pm Comments (38)
Zack - Then why didn't he just say "Yes"? Another debate liveblog... 
Matt: Because Obama understands it is a complex issue--and so he answered it like an adult. Is Wolf moderating a debate to be watched by morons. Yes or no this, yes or no that... Unreal!
Screw the yes and no. Let be a reason
If Obama knows it's a complicated issue to answer, why has he been attacking Senator Clinton for the past two weeks about not being "straightforward" with the country? Seems like tonight, her simple "No!" was more straightforward than his answer.
If Obama knows it's a complicated issue to answer, why has he been attacking Senator Clinton for the past two weeks about not being "straightforward" with the country? Seems like tonight, her simple "No!" was more straightforward than his answer.
Clinton hasn't been criticized because her previous answer was too complex, she was criticized because she gave two different answers that directly contradicted each other.
Saying you understand why but don't support is not two answers. Thanks, Obama. You totally lost your momentum on that offensive.
Obama didn't handle the issue well rhetorically, but he was rather clear about his stance. Clinton on the other hand suggested that she might support the issue in the last debate, and then two weeks later, right after Spitzer dropped the issue, officially came out against it. And the press is applauding her for this schtick -- sort of sad.
She was unclear at the debate, then she was for it now she is against it. Its a complex question, a good answer is not a simple yes or no, but she has clearly had multiple views on it, and explained a rational for none of them.
Obama is trying to have it both ways just like the Washington pol that he is. He is too calculated and scripted.
Obama is trying to have it both ways just like the Washington pol that he is. He is too calculated and scripted.
OBama did not get tripped up. he said yes, he even said he had done it. I am suprised Blitzer did not follow up on clinton's answere of no, since she was for it until today. Texas Dem: Obama attacked Hillary on the issue, because she had said yes and no to the quesiton. Obama has it right, illegals are not coming her to drive. They are coming for work. If the federal gov't can't stop them from coming in, teh State has an obligation to the majority of its citizens to make sure these people are trained drivers and have auto insurance.
Uhm, Obama said yes (he's done it), no- it's not what he wants, and yes he's for it ** (as a part of something else). The man's got audacity-- but from what I saw, he's pretty hopeless.
You have to love the Obama supporters here -- saying that this AWFUL exchange is NOT evidence of his stumbling or getting tripped up. Amazing. One can rightly point to the silliness of Blitzer and his simplistic schtick, but that's a completely different issue -- that is what it is. It was Russert's gotcha schtick that messed with Hillary last time. However unfair, this is a lousy moment for him in this debate...and he had a similar one on the Meet The Press when he danced around a Social Security question. Failing to acknowledge this as a problem is pure denial.
Blitzer wanted it broken down into moron form. Obama presented his reasoning. His answer even seemed to be very much supported by Gov. Richardson experience in New Mexico. If anything, I would say Wolf was the loser in this debate with 'yes' or 'no' questions. Sometimes it's necessary with politicians, but he applied it to haphazardly.
I watched this evening and Hillary was by far the weakest candidate. She couldn't say anything one way without saying it the other. Bill could get away with it, but he never had to face so many bright and informed candidates. Hillary was out of her league. sorry. She was a full step below all the others. The Republicans will eat her lunch, unfortunately. I actually like her, but she hasn't the ability to stay up. I expect to see her numbers decrease continually.
Barack knows they are gonna come and get him ,lou dobbs
Democrates need to come hard on immigration or else we gonna loose this election again,Illegal immigrates are illegal thats it come on when are we gonna learn
To Mr. Lopez, What other laws that the Federal government is struggling to enforce (illegal drug use, racketeering, or identity fraud for example) would you suggest the States accomodate the perpetrator instead of policing their territories and protecting their Citizens and legal residents? If you woke up one morning and an unknown family was living in your backyard, would you agree that your state should force you to provide immunizations for the interlopers children because your state was obligated to keep all its citizens healthy? Ridiculous.
This is ridiculous. This is a poor example for how to conduct an election, guys. Wake up. Our debates have devolved into WolfBlizzard™ trying to force candidates into gaffe moments... maybe CNN is desperate to sell stock footage, I don't know. I actually think everything Barack said there made perfect sense, and he outlined it in a very straightforward way. I didn't understand the issue beforehand, now I do. Obama wants to crack down at the borders, but make sure that anyone driving in this country knows what "yield" means. So do I. But WolfBlizzard seems obsessed with trying to force candidates into anti-intellectual yes-or-no gotcha moments, trying to make them say something that will make sensational headlines tomorrow. Is he a moderator, or a hypeman -- like Don King I mean, he INSTIGATED tonight. What a loser. We need more journalists. CNN is a joke, and Rupert Murdoch is the bastard laughing. If there are any journalists out there would you please conspire to take WolfBlizzard's job. He has a blizzard to go to. This country deserves the president we've got if this is the way we conduct debates.
Democrats are using the same strategy they used in 06 to gain the majority in Congress. They run candidates who claim to be against giving benefits to illegals, against amnesty, and for punishing employers. But once elected they support a "path to citizenship", of course they thrive on providing goodies and giveaways, and they are beholding to the owners of capital who thrive on endless cheap labor. The GOP under GW has been far from consistent on illegal immigration, but compared to Democrats......
This whole issue around drivers licenses for undocumented aliens, illegal aliens (deference to Lou Dobbs) is specious. We have an illegal immigration problem for one reason and one reason only...to allow business owners (large and small) a pool of cheap labor. Reagan (Mr. McGoo) started it and Bush, Clinton, and Bush again have looked the other way in order to please greedy business owners...want to stop illegal immigration? Put those who hire them in jail for ten years and you'll immediately see a dramatic drop off in the number of illegal border crossings. If they come here to work, and they do, and they can't get work, the word will get around.
CNN put on the worst presidential "debate" debacle there has been so far. The booing was offensive, the post show analysis was biased, and it is disturbing to think this night could have anything to do with electing a president.
Political strategists have long identified wedge issues, oversimplify them in yes or no terms, trap opponents into answering them on this level and then swift boat them. Obama was correct in trying to avoid this trap. While The Right has us in hysterics over Illegal Immigration and the backbreaking low pay jobs they procure, The Right wing endorses the whole sale exporting of millions of white collar high tech IT and other good paying communications jobs overseas to India and other countries. Where is the outrage towards our American companies are selling out the American people for a profit.....? Where is our demand for Patriotism from these American companies...? Where is the Minute Men coalition guarding our borders to keep the jobs that would bring livable wages to hard working American families INSIDE our Country....?
Hey, I watched this debate and I challenge anybody to tell me what Hillary actually believes on any issue asked. Example---social Security/Medicare; she said "I think we should handle it by getting back to fiscal responsibility." What the hell does that mean? Fiscal responsibility as in raising taxes or cutting spending? Probably not raising taxes, so what spending will she cut? Military? OK, what part of the military budget will she cut? Weapons, soldier's pay? WHAT?!!! I'm serious, I do not know what she is thinking. She talks the longest and says the least. That is why I cannot vote for Hillary. I do not trust her judgment to do the right thing. She too slick for me. Sen. Obama says what he thinks. That's why I must vote for him. I am thirsting for a straight talking human being in the White House.
Obama was a big loser in thise debate. After pummeling Clinton for 2 weeks for not giving a simple Yes or No answer for the immigration issue, he stumbled on the same question! Incredible. He started once by saying "Yes..But" and the crowd started groaning in pain! Similarly for the American Security question, he could not give a simple Yes or No. He was giving the run around. Pathetic.
No one here is going to convince another of which candidate won. And whomever said this drivers license issue is specious is absolutely correct. Clinton spent two weeks not answering, then answering yes than emphatically (today I believe) answering no. That is waffling with the political winds. All the other candidates, with all their varying views on the subject have said the same thing each time they were asked. That is taking a stand and sticking with it no matter how politically damaging...that is called principle.
He said before and he said again tonight that borders come first, employer crackdowns come next, then you work to get the folks already here to be legal (if they follow the path) which includes giving them licenses. So did most of the other candidates say that before and again tonight. Dodd just said no each time he was asked. But that's the difference. They all took a stand...except the triangulating queen. The drivers license issue is not an issue. Illegal immigration is.
And Marc, if you want to be honest in your reporting you might include the exchange with Ms. Brown that immediately preceded your *full* transcript...in case you don't want to read it all, Obama had already answered the question when Wolf went off on his yes or no tangent... BROWN: All right, let's talk about the issues. Senator Obama, I want to ask you about immigration. It's an important issue in this state in particular. There are between 100,000 to 200,000 illegal immigrants here in Nevada. And you supported various benefits for illegal immigrants, including drivers licenses and in-state college tuition. What do you say to those Americans who say they are losing out because you would give benefits to people who broke the laws of this country, who came here illegally. And then more generally, as president, where do you draw the line when it comes to benefits for illegal immigrants? OBAMA: I would say that they're justified in feeling frustrated because this administration, the Bush administration, has done nothing to control the problem that we have. We've had 5 million undocumented workers come over the borders since George Bush took office. It has become an extraordinary problem. The reason the American people are concerned is because they are seeing their own economic positions slip away. Oftentimes, employers are exploiting these undocumented workers. They're not paying the minimum wage. They're not observing worker safety laws. So what we have to do is create a comprehensive solution to the problem. Now, I have already stated that as president I will make sure that we finally have the kind of border security that we need. That's step number one. Step number two is to take on employers. Right now, an employer has more of a chance of getting hit by lightning than be prosecuted for hiring an undocumented worker. That has to change. They have to be held accountable. (APPLAUSE) And when we do those things... (APPLAUSE) When we do those things, I believe that we can take the undocumented workers, the illegal aliens who are here, get them out of the shadows, make sure that they are subject to a stiff penalty, make sure that they're learning English, make sure that they go to the back of the line so they're not getting an advantage over people who came here legally. And when we do that, I think that we can, instead of shedding all this heat, start shedding some light on the problem, and we can once again be a nation of laws and a nation of immigrants. That's what I intend to do as president of the United States.
Richardson, answered clearly, and with strong reason, Biden, knew that yes is the correct answer, but pandered to the fear of the American people, and although his body language showed he knew better he clearly set aside his principles. Clinton, however clearly showed her political savy, and played to the base. Obama of course was set up, and we are discovering that the politics of hope, a new dialogue and cooperation between a wide sprectum of ideas to build consensis is clearly not in fashion with the media of American public. We want it seems simple bigoted responses from the right or left, and winners or loosers on every specific issue. We are not apparently interested in problem solving. I was moving away from Obama until last night, Dennis is earning my admiration. I don't think he can be elected, and his voice from the outside is so important he should not be silenced by the demands of holding together a party as president. Biden is smart, as is Edwards, but Richardson boreing as someone described him, has substance and stands on the right side of many issues. Hillary troubles me, I would like to vote for a woman, who would bring personal passion and perspective to the political process. Hillary however, represents the power brokers, and preforms like a well trained spokesman for the real power pulling the strings. I fear that Hillary could be more dangerous in giving away our representative democracy than a right wing Repub. who had to work with the checks of even an impotent Dem party. Hillary would have free reign in her corporate agenda.
Obama was clearly the most presidential of the lot. check it out: http://www.fredomroadproject.blogspot.come
Obama was terrible last night, and giving illegals driver's licenses is incongruent with our national policy. We need to protect the American middle class first -- against corporate greed, terrorism, and yes, illegal immigration -- and then, only then, do we allow those who've been here for a few years to receive amnesty. Join NumbersUSA to support an enforcement first policy.
Illegal Aliens and Immigration is NOT the same thing. 80% of the American people want an end to anarchy! This is NOT a Democrat, Republican, Independent issue. It's an American Issue.
Obama can beat the Woman up for two weeks for being unclear about a question asked for the first time in the last debate, but when he can't give a clear answer TWO WEEKS later it's ok??? No other person on that stage would get cut any slack on this. Is Obama playing the R. card? Or is he just "O.J.ing" (race trumps gender)a white woman??
Actually I think Hillary's comments in the previous Philadelphia debate were pretty clear and the whole issue was totally made up by Obama / media to go after her. She did not like or agree with giving licenses to illegal immigrants, but knows that Spitzer needed to try something because Bush failed at a more comprehensive solution, and that at least Spitzer was trying to do something which would help in the limited way of making sure when someone got in an accident they had identification.
Obama's real problem? Poor choice of words. OBAMA: When I was a state senator in Illinois, I voted to require that illegal aliens get trained, get a license, get insurance to protect public safety. That was my intention. APPLAUSE Do the viewers pick up on this? Probably not. But consistency counts. Among his Democrat challengers, he's getting a pass. But against a Republican the word usage would be exploited for all it is worth.
"Enforcement first" should be the immediate response of all candidates right now and then they can describe in detail their ideas on immigration reform. One thing I didn't understand Obama on was when he said that after paying a stiff fine, the illegals go to the back of the line so they're not ahead of immigrants who came here legally. That doesn't make sense. Simply by being here, they're already ahead of those who are waiting to even get in. I'd say that as slow as our immigration process works, they're years ahead of other immigrants. So we're still talking amnesty and that's a problem for those who don't want to reward illegal behavior - like the 75% opposing driver's licenses.
Obama stumbled. He attacked Hillary for giving the same [but briefer] answer that he gave Blitzer. He clearly did not articulate his exact differences with Clinton regarding Healthcare, and it became painfully clear that Obama speaks like a professor in debates and eqivocates. He doesn't have the toughness and ease necessary to go all the way. Or the ability to frame his ideas within the terms of debates, re: time allowances and very clearly articulated explanations that must be brief because that's what debates demand. Even if he wins Iowa I predict he won't make it all the way. His currrent paranoia is that Clinton's camp has told [of all people] the toxic Robert Novak Consider the political stupidity of this. Novak the arch conservative who outed Valerie Plame and is entirely untrustworthy goes and tells Obama group that Hillary has "something on him". What's even loonier is that Novak loathes Democrats and Obama believes him? This kind of political quackery rife with Obama crying foul is too ridiculous to be believed.
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The first two sentences out of Obama's mouth answered the question.
Posted by Zack | November 15, 2007 9:37 PM