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First Take: The Final Republican Debate

12 Dec 2007 03:22 pm

The headline is that no one laid a glove on Mike Huckabee. And that Mitt Romney had a hell of a good afternoon. He seemed more sinewy than usual, less programmed, quite (dare we say) presidential, and even-tempered.

The debate format was not given to exchanges, and the moderator peremptorily took immigration off the table. The audience did not cheer, really, or validate, or boo.
Romney and Huckabee were like two cultivars of fine Iowa maize.

Both appealed directly to middle class Iowans. Romney said he was concerned about the tax burden on middle class families and promised health insurance for all by the end of his first term.

Huckabee invoked his humble origins and said that elected officials ought to “not represent the elite, but represent the ordinary.” Romney arguably had the stronger day, but he needed to upstage Huckabee without seeming to attack him. Romney repeatedly returned to his core message, and had ample time to remind Iowans of his executive experience and his record on education and health care.

Giuliani was challenged on the mistress security expense issue and used the occasion to remind people that he is mortal. “On the issue of transparency, I can’t think of a public figure who has led a more transparent life.”

Fred Thompson was smart, funny, irascible and consistent, and probably helped his standing here. He even got in a good dig at Romney.

John McCain seemed tired, Ron Paul was Ron Paul, and Alan Keyes wasn’t making sense.

Comments (111)

I thought Huckabee really picked things up towards the end. Especially his remarks about being the "united states of America"...

Romney was good, but I picked up on the same thing the other candidates kept pointing out -- his laundry lists seem memorized and/or mechanical. It makes it hard to feel he really cares about the issues. It sounds good otherwise.

Could Huckabee be more of a religious socialist here?

As Huckabee rises to the top of the pack he continues to stand out from the crowd as the authentic Conservative among them. Fair tax, offense on terror, border fence and solidly pro-life...this is the candidate I have been waiting for!

He's the most socialist conservative I've ever seen...

Richie Rich Romney got some good face time, but still sounded a little like he'd sell you a great used car. Huck wins by virtue of escaping frontrunner attacks. Fred helped himself but not enough. Best moment was when Huck said a president should not shy from speaking to issues such as kids dropping out of school. If Romney had not made his own odd religion a focal point by playing the victim card he'd probably escaped all the scrutiny now going on about it.

Marc has a crush on Romney

If I want religion I will go to a church. I don't need a president telling me what is right or wrong. If he continues to put religion into government it will divide this country even more. That is what Bush has done and I have had enough. Our problems in this country have nothing to do with religion, we need real answers from our Gov't and it's citizens of how to fix the mess we are in using our heads not religious dogma.

Why is Giuliani the only one who got challenged on an allegation against him by the moderator? Because the liberal mainstream media hates him and would rather that anybody else besides him get nominated. They know he has the best chance of winning the general election.

Huckabee say what people want to hear that day. He is such a lier and flip flopper. I'd vote for Hillery before I would vote for him.

This was one of the most fair debates in that they allowed more time for everybody to speak.

Still, I found it funny that a lot of them seemed to be taking some of Ron Paul's lines, especially about following the constitution. In past debates, NONE of them except for Ron ever said anything remotely similar. It's obvious they're trying to seem a little less war-like, more concerned with the rule of law and respect freedom, even though their records show otherwise.

Romney was more plastic than usual. I thought his remarks about the "fine people of Iowa" were more of his PR contrivance than actual honesty. When you check the facts on Romney, you find everything he's saying is total crap designed to get votes. His record doesn't match his rhetoric. I have to add that if anybody feels he's presidential, it's because they've been watching too many movies and too much TV-- where image matters more than substance.

Huckabee was also more plastic than usual. His moral candidate thing is hilarious to me because, when you really look at his record (pardoning criminals, parolling a rapist that later raped and murdered again, ethics violations, tax increases, etc) you find he's actually a liar. This is not without precedence, sad as it is, religious figures have lied before. Just ask Ted Haggard and Jim Bakker.

Giuliani was the same as he's always been. Can't trust him, either. His political profiteering of a horrible tragedy, the Kerik scandal, his three wives, his using of public funds to set up "dates" with his mistress, along with the fact that the New York Fire Dept hates his guts makes me cringe when they flash his face on the screen. I hope he loses miserably.

Tancredo came up better here. He has some good things to say, but I can never forget his "Bomb Mecca" remark. That makes him completely disqualified in my book.

Duncan Hunter was the same pretty much. He doesn't have the same glossy packaging as Romney or Giulliani, but he's just as crappy. He's probably the only one that's as dirty as Giuliani. Whenever I see Hunter, I can't help but think of his ethics violations and his cozy ties to defense contractors.

Thompson was the same. Boring and contrived. I could care less if he makes a joke, so long as he has something of substance to say, but he doesn't. He doesn't have the writers of Law and Order to make him seem smarter than what he actually is. I also love the fact that he was an abortion lobbyist and is now pro-life. Nixon's description of Thompson was the best: "Dumb, but friendly." Classic.

McCain should drop out. I'm really tired of him. Really. Go away, John. Please.

I thought Keyes was pretty funny in a "look at the crazy nut" kind of way. He was more a distraction than anything.

Giuliani: B
Huckabee: B-
Hunter: B
Keyes: B+
McCain: C-
Paul: A-
Romney: B-
Tancredo: C+
Thompson: A-

No 'D's or 'F's this time. Best faces were put on to woo the Buckeyes. Not a great show, but not a bad one, either.

Please... Ron Paul was the best out of all of them. His policies and ideas actually have backing and merit rather than just a lot of hot air. Huckawho? The tax raiser who lets rapists out of prison just so they can rape again? He's full of hot air, has a glass jaw and will fail miserably in every state after Iowa.

Alan Keyes had a better performance when Borat was describing to him how a gay man violated him a rubber fist, then he did during this entire debate.

Alan Keyes had a better performance when Borat was describing to him how a gay man violated him with a rubber fist, then he did during this entire debate

Here's what Huckabee is: a momentarily pleasant mouthwash to rid one's mouth of the taste of vomit that Romney and the others cause to rise in one's throat. He's refreshing at first, but you eventually have to spit him out too.

Huck is probably on rudy's payrol.... he is there to screw Romney then kiss up to Rudy to be his VP only to get bumped for one of Rudy's thugs later on. I do not see how Huckabee can get rid of the IRS (think Ron Paul has been saying that for 30 years) but Mike thinks he can keep the millitary empire, police state, and welfare system funded AND cut taxes?? That is more retarded Bushicnomics that has ruined the dollar and wrecked the housing market. The "Fair Tax" though better than income tax will make inflation even worse and kill the local economy and land values. It is a half ass solution to a big problem that Mike just don't get.

For me at the end of the day it is all about our pollicy over seas. I am a US MARINE vet and Ron Paul is the only man on either side who feels the way I do about when to go to war and knows best how to keep us safe.. Did the Huckster serve in the millitary???

Going on the slim fast diet don't qualify you for the job and neither does having all the money in the world, being Mayor when a city that is attacked or getting captured in Nam. I see a real trend of these Republicans running on their past tragic life events or trying to buy their way in....

If Romney is such agood business man why would he spend 10 million of his own money the get a job that only pays a few hundred thousand a year??

Um, Tonewah... it's the Hawkeyes.

Buckeyes is Ohio.

The debate was pretty solid; well done Des Moines Register.

I was a Huckabee supporter before this debate. I have been swayed to the Romney camp. Huckabee is all smoke and mirrors. I felt like he didn't have a solid command of the issues. Romney's answers were very well thought out. I liked it when he talked about uniting the conservatives. This is a very valid point. Huckabee cannot pull the fiscal conservative vote with his platform. Romney made a strong argument for his candidacy by bringing up his professional background. He just looked presidential too.

They reason no one should believe/read the Grades posted by Tonewah: Keyes B+?!? Come on bud, who isn't praising the mainstream media right now for not subjecting us to a heavy dose of Alan Keyes!! That guy was like a little kid with a preacher voice tattling on people.
PS did anyone notice that he was cropped out of the pan shots that showed the entire stage, hilarious!

Huckabee really disappointed me in this debate. He was just like Thompson. He was all media hype.

Ron is haveing an effect. I think all but Giuliani have discovered the Constitution and
some may have read it.

In one of the first debates, Ron Paul introduced himself as “champion of the constitution”, to which the moderator (Chris Matthews, I believe) muttered “Oh Gawd…”

When Paul entered the race, Constitution talk was cause for derision. Now it’s in vogue. Imagine that.

A vote for Huckabee is a vote for Hillary, vote rudy/romney/mccain instead.

Yes, Ron Paul and his Paulites have moved the discussion quite a bit. Huckabee is asking where it is in the Bible, Romney is having his lawyers looking it over, Thompson has it on his "to do" list, Giulani is saying "we didn't need it on 9/11", and McCain may have actually read parts of it and that is why he looking so depressed.

Mark, you fail to mention that none of Huckabee's comments, nor any other of the candidates, specifically Rudy Giuliani, were really all that authentic or original. It was Ron Paul who first brought up the elimination of the IRS and that the Fed. should not be involved in the education system and still with all the proof in the pudding, no other candidate is able to speak intelligently about monetary and a disiplined foreign policy and - except Ron Paul.

With so much attention going to Ron Paul for real thought and ideas critical to all Americans, it seems to me, and I've watched every debate plus do plenty of reading on each candidate, that the same old cliches of yesteryear such as "unite", "come together", "opptimistic future", Greater America" all wrapped in a nice MSM media package is NOT (and never will again) going to cut mustard with an informed American populous.

Americans won't be mislead this time around !

Ron Paul in this debate and most of the others never speaks in ambiguous terms - always has facts and knowledge backing him up. No fluff.

Ron Paul will very likely win Iowa and Hew Hampshire.

A vote for Paul is also a vote for Hillary

Mitt Romney hit a grand slam today.

Mitt will make a great president!

Most qualified candidate from either party....by far.

Too bad Huckabee always says he doesn't feel it's his responsibility to point out what he feels is or isn't the right (or wrong) religion; only that his faith helps enhance himself, and that he wouldn't impose that on other people.

Umm, isn't that what the founding of this country is? That, while we all follow for the most part the same values and principles as a secular state, anyone can practice whatever religion they want and not be shunned and condemned for it (provided they don't interfere with a citizen's right to life, liberty and property).....i'll say it in simple terms...duh.

Elitist Romney just goes to show you when he said that he doesn't have to worry about taxes: of course not, because he has so much money it's a non issue for him.

I would think that Huck would have a chance against Hillary. They would have a hard time bringing up the rape issue with Bill standing next to her. His comments on his faith and gays are no different than those of any other Republican. And some of his moderate views would give those who don't want to vote for Hillary a reason not to.

Also, Huck is far more attractive to the base... Key word being "BASE". W would never have made it without the Christian base. None of the other candidates are appealing, that is why he has become attractive

Huckabee did good by being the front runner and not fumbling.

Thumbnail review:

Thompson: In command (insert "Law and Order" SFX here)

Romney: Scripted and oleaginous; overhyping a slim record in Mass. Couldn't knock out Huckabee.

Huckabee: Smooth, calm, friendly, thoughtful -- a nice guy. (BTW, doesn't Huck have a longer record as governor than Romney?)

McCain: Needs to take a nap (maybe waterboarding would wake him up)

Keyes: Who knew he was running again? Pointed out the huge problem with the debate format.

Tancredo: Why bother to show up if you don't get to talk about the big "I."

Hunter: Smart guy but no hope (couldn't he donate his time to one of the guys with an actual chance).

Giuliani: Phoning it in and shrinking with every new scandal question. He couldn't manage a cheap, tawdry extra-marital affair, so why does he think he could handle the Presidency.

Paul: The foil-hatters will say he won (without even bothering to watch the debate), but to the other 98% of Republicans, he sounded like somebody's crazy old grandpa.

Lincoln and Douglas: Rolling in their respective graves that this mess was called a "debate."

Dustin, I'm fairly well convinced that Paul is the only Republican candidate who has a chance against Hillary. He's already got strong appeal among normally Liberal-leaning college students, and he's a stronger anti-war candidate than she is, which is likely to be one of the biggest issues in this election.

Mind you, I'm not convinced that Hillary will wind up taking the Democratic nomination.

Huckabee held his spot at the top. I am from Arkansas and can tell you he left this state in much better shape than he found it.

"As Huckabee rises to the top of the pack he continues to stand out from the crowd as the authentic Conservative among them. Fair tax, offense on terror, border fence and solidly pro-life"


More federal government intervention in health care and education. More energy mandates. No sound monetary policy or dealing with the debt. More taxes and more amnesty for illegals. Yay!!

This election will NOT be about the war. We already know where everyone stands. And, W is not running. The "we hate George and his war" stuff isn't going to work. That is why the Dems are trying to turn to issues.

REPORT CARD (I watched the entire debate on Fox which included Frank Luntz's 31 person undecided Republican Focus Group intant feedback graph)

MODERATOR F-

ROMNEY A- (talked economics very well)

THOMPSON B+ (challenged the moderator)

GUILIANI C

MCCAIN C+

HUCKABEE C- (people in the focus group thought he appeared to be a second tier candidate - also his graphing lines consistently stayed in the middle range.

KEYES F- (EXPELLED OR SUSPENDED WITHOUT CREDIT)

Ron Paul - his graph kept diving to the floor - but at least he is capable of 30 second answers

Everyone else - who cares.

Huckabee once again showed his liberal socialist side. He once again delflected as he so masterfully does.

How in the world does ANYONE honestly think this man will do anything about immigration short of giving them all a low rate home loan and a free dental policy?

Romney was the big winner - everyone was waiting for him to get negative but he did not fall for the bait - why attack Huckabigot when the media is having a feeding frenzy with his BIGOTED anti Mormon drivel.

Fred was better than usual -

I didn't get a chance to watch this debate. I'm home from work now, scurrying to find video of it...

But let me say this. Ten weeks ago I decided to support Mike Huckabee. I decided to support him even after reviewing all of his so-called negatives: his "ethics violations", his "tax-hiking", his "releasing of Dumond", and the fact that he's a Christian conservative on par with Dan Quayle and....Ronald Reagan.

All this information about Huckabee has been readily available for the last several YEARS. The fact that it became shocking "news" over the last two weeks is an embarrasment for the national press corps and any voter who claims to be informed about his party's candidates.

I'm supporting Huckabee (even financially!) for many reasons, including the following:

- He has demonstrated great skill at working with those in government with different ideologies.

- He is strong on defense.

- He has signed the no tax pledge. And supports The Fair Tax

- He is the most charming and likeable of any of the Republicans - which is an invaluable asset against Hillary.

- I want to stick a thumb in the eye of the conservative elite which decided on Romney and Giuliani nine months ago and never gave McCain or Huckabee a chance.

Jared:

You are a Moron posting re a debate you admit you have not seen - that is different than a Mormon

I think Huckabee has two things that Romney lacks: charisma and a sense of humor. Those are the major requirements, I think, when you're campaigning face to face in states that don't know you well. I think that's the the reason why Romney can spend a bazillion dollars and still be easily pushed aside by somebody like Huckabee. Ron Paul's the only Repub out there who doesn't seem to be willing to say or do ANYTHING to win. Speaking truth to power is very charismatic.

Amen Jared. Huckabee is not like the elite "conservatives", he cares about the people who, like him, want to live the American dream and provide a better life for his family than those before him. He cares about the people who drive the country. Romney wouldn't undersand what humble beginings are about. He would have to organize a study group to help him. Also, there is something about a man who spent $7 mil. trailing to a man who spent $300,000.

Jo, the Democratic party is very united this year, many many of the moderates have decided to vote democrat, even my mom. Who says "I just want someone that's smart." People in this country feel that Bush made a lot of poor decisions because he just isn't very smart. Bush's lack work ethic and acumen hurt us way more than his morality helped us. The non-"base" part of America is VERY wary of Huckabee because he basically represents, religious thinking instead of educated decisions. "He seems like a good guy" is not a good reason to vote for someone because for all you know he could be a sub-par decision maker but a great politician. Non-evangelicals would run from Huckabee to someone smarter and more private about religion, and FAST. Clinton Yale J.D. Huckabee some baptist place??

Dustin, he ran the state of Arkansas for 10 years. I'm there. The state is developing at a very rapid rate. If people would look into what he has really done, they would see that he has the experience to run the country, at least as much as the others. Also, if you send someone out there that is out of touch with the base, they don't stand a chance to begin with.

Example: TaraBoomdeay said "charisma and a sense of humor. Those are the major requirements" Really? if those are the major requirements than your saying that Mike Huckabee is the funniest most charismatic man in America???? Why not vote for John Stewart then? No folks if you vote like that you leave yourself open to being fooled by great politicians. This is not to say that Huckabee isn't a great guy it's just people are liking him for the wrong reasons

Also, Bush is a Yale alum, and most "moderates"
vote Dem anyway.

Jo, that would be a fine reason to vote for the man. I still believe though that his public religiousity would lose him a general election because it only represents one portion of America, the rest of the country loves their neighbor too much to hate on Mormons and round up gays with AIDS. Again Huckabee is a good man, he wouldn't be running for president if he wasn't, but these he MUST account for first.

Dustin, I love your flawed logic. You say Bush is dumb, yet you imply Clinton is smart because she got a J.D. from Yale. You must have forgotten that Bush got an MBA from Harvard. You can't have it both ways.

That's why bush won he appealed to both economic and social conservatives. Without the Harvard MBA, many economic conservatives would have shifted to Gore.

All i'm implying is that Huckabee has no educational street cred for econ conservatives

Why was the turnout so high in 2004 for Bush. Kerry ran on the same platform as the rest of the Dems. In 06 the Dems had to move to the right and started courting the religious vote. If you nominate a conservative, he/she will win on every issue. That is why there have only been 2 Dems in the white house since 1968.

Dustin,

Anyone that thinks liberalism is a good thing is obviously NOT smart. A basic economics course would tell you that government intervention in free markets (healthcare, welfare, financial markets, etc.) will lower the standard of living of people within the country. The problem with this country is that people are not taught the principles of the capitalist system because the socialist department of education sets the curriculm for all of the sheep that are mandated to go to public school. If people were taught to think rationally, a libertarian like Ron Paul would probably win every election. Unfortunately, people develop heuristics to make complex problems easier but may be based on faulty assumptions. If Paul does not get the nomination, then I will vote for Romney because he is a proven businessman that understands capitalism better than nearly every person in this country.

"many economic conservatives would have shifted to Gore."

What?


As a Christian I like Mike Huckabee alot, I find him funny and easy going and If I was picking a church and pastor he would be 1st on my list....

But we are Not picking a Pastor, we are picking a President, someone with real smarts that studies things out and looks out for the American people. We need an economic genius and a man who is good natured and lives a good life.

Mitt Romney

If you actually study what he has accomplish,it amazing and you'll walk away impressed and realize that he is the man to lead the country and whether or not I agree with faith or not.....

I like Romney and I am disappointed in Huckabee on a number of issues, he is not the answer. He is worst than most liberals I have seen.....

I may not agree with Romney's faith, but I really think we need Romney

Council Bluffs, Iowa

For all of those who think Romney has Huckabee in an economic headlock.

http://www.spectator.org/dsp_article.asp?art_id=12427

This clears up Romney's Immigration stance as well.

Jo, Bush won because Kerry was a weirdo
Jim, I love economics and completely ascribe to all of you thoughts, however I also feel that because other people don't know economics as well as Ron Paul, and because Ron Paul is completely unwilling to be pragmatic in policy and basically meet people halfway, he would get nothing done in government and would alienate too many people. Thus Dems would easily win an election against him (I think I still have some reservations due to his war stance). He's a great thinker but not close enough to the center to win. Ron Paul supporter usually mirror this same quality.

Bush won because Kerry was a weirdo/flip floper.

Romney=flip floper

The Dems will eat this up after what happened to Kerry.

My point remains, many Economic Conservatives will not vote for Mike Huckabee in a general election. Thus a vote for Huck is a vote for Hill

Not voting for someone because you think their a "flip-flopper" is just about as dangerous as voting for someone because "they have charisma" isn't it. Both views can be swayed by the media and attacks from other candidates. Only idiots never change their minds.

They should have given McCain more time.

I doubt enough people watched the debate for it to make much of a difference. Maybe it will change a few people in Iowa, but not really in the rest of the country.

McCain (and to a lesser extent Giuliani) are the only Republicans who can win in a general election. A vote for anyone else in the primary is a vote for Hillary or Obama in the general.

I couldn't vote for Huckabee even if my life depended on it. You know people talk about Mitt Romney filp-flopping yet Huckabee has flipped on numerous occasions in the past week or two. Dustin You're definitely right and lets not forget that Huckabee vetoed a bill that would have prohibited illegal immigrants state benifits because he called it race baiting

Mitt Romney = Quiet Confidence

The rest seem like High Schoolers trying to look and act "smart". You can't fake "smart". Mitt Romney epitomizes intelligence, experience and class. Mitt Romney = SMART. That's what America needs---

Romney was the big winner - everyone was waiting for him to get negative but he did not fall for the bait - why attack Huckabigot when the media is having a feeding frenzy with his BIGOTED anti Mormon drivel.

Fred was better than usual -

Voting for a man who changed his position BECAUSE he is running for president is safe.

"I'm not like those Reagan conservatives"

Dustin posted:
"Jim, I love economics and completely ascribe to all of you thoughts, however…and because Ron Paul is completely unwilling to be pragmatic in policy and basically meet people halfway, he would get nothing done in government"

Assuming you were agreeing that a libertarian free-market economy is desirable, what types of economic things should Ron Paul "get done" via the federal government?

Romney rocked this debate!

Saying that Huckabee is anti-mormon because he displays is faith is like saying that the NRA is against gun safety practices.

Nobody laid a glove on Huck?

Sorry. Thompson did great and that is votes away from Huckabee.

There have been some great points made and I love a good debate, but I gotta go.

The reason Ron Paul will never get the nomination is that he lives in the world of ideals. He doesn't have a single pragmatic bone in his body. If by some miracle he were elected, he would veto more bills every day than any other president has in an entire term. I cannot fault the man and his conviction to the Constitution, but a man like that would bring the Federal Government to a screeching halt. He'd be impeached before he ever took the oath.

I am for Obama. He will help America and the World. He is smart, passed 688 bills in the Senate and has been in the legislature since '97. He can unite the Country and prepare for the twenty-first century. The racially-mixed kids in this country have quadrupled and he represents what is NOW!

Jo, Lets assume for a second that what you say is true. Let say that Mitt changed his abortion position because he wanted to run for president. How would that effect you, or our country if he's elected? Would it mean that he's secretly going to change back? Sounds outlandish, it's an irrational fear really. So maybe you think it means he's not very solid conservative and he might lose he conservative view later. This is also doubtful given his record and his personal life. Really I think it has more to do with his views on separation between church and state. He doesn't condone abortion in anyway, but for a time, when he was new in politics he though it was o.k. to believe one way and let the people be free to do another. He later changed this view. It's a very small matter, but the irrational media (CNN) and other opponents have painted him as constantly changing. For me I think it's reasonable. There too many good things he's done for me not to overlook it.

Jacqueline, how do you feel about the cavalier way that Obama discusses his past drug-use.

Akston, gosh specifics, i feel like your calling my bluff. A hypothetical President Paul could try to convince America Trade policies with china aren't hurting us, neither is the devaluation of their currency. Basically their giving us a discount on everything we buy let them keep it up. Lou Dobbs, could talk all night about how Americans are losing jobs but really we should be focused on retraining those workers to do something more productive. This is true in economics (Bastiat "Economic Sophisms") however President Pual wouldn't be believed because he says all kind of other crazy (but true) stuff at the same time like we caused global jihad 30 years ago with crummy foreign policy. Being a good leader involves changing people erroneous views to true ones, though Ron has good views, sadly, he doesn't have the rhetorical abilities to change others.

David, that's how Paul is painted, and in certain respects it's true. You're absolutely right about him probably vetoing a lot, especially in the first year. I'm not sure what charge you think he would be impeached on.

However, he does have some strong pragmatism in his positions... he just doesn't often get a chance to display it, because he's too busy spending his 30 seconds of screen time explaining yet again that he will not run as an independent.

For instance, yes, his ultimate goal is to end income tax, but he's repeatedly said that he knows it won't happen overnight. In his plan for Social Security, existing entitlement commitments will be honored, but individuals will be allowed to opt out of the system so it will shrink in the future. His goals are idealistic and will not waver, but that doesn't mean he's going to try to jump to them in one blind leap.

Hell, in congress the man puts earmarks on spending bills before voting against them, because if the money's going to be taken away from his constituents he'd rather get some of it back. That's pragmatism to a T.

tejon,

I never meant to imply that Paul would do anything worthy of impeachment, but surely the legislature would trump something up for a man set to be at such odds with them.
As I said, I think that Paul's devotion to the Constitution and its very narrow federal government provisions is refreshing. The problem is that the veto power was INTENDED to be used sparingly. Paul would be certain to infuriate the legislature and would be entirely ineffective as an executive. 200 years ago, I'm sure that Ron Paul and James Madison would have been best friends, but with the current inflated, power-hungry view the federal government has of itself, he is simply marching too much to the beat of a different drummer.

I watched the debate and the one thing I noticed was that they were all trying to sound more like Ron Paul. The Constitution, smaller government, less taxes, the Federal Government out of education, were issues that were the talk of the day. Issues "borrowed" from Dr. Paul. The media is hyping the preacher man, Elmer (Gantry) Huckabee because he will never be elected president and the media monopoly wants Hillary to win. Elmer Huckabee is the former governor of the most corrupt "good old boys" state in the South. He will never survive close scrutiny and he will not get it unless he is the nominee. This is a man that destroyed 300 state owned computer hard drives to keep his secrets safe. Anyone that thinks that that his candidacy isn't being driven by out side sources, (not divine intervention) is naive. Media manipulation is easily achieved when trying to sway the uninformed. That is why people should not vote for someone because "he looks presidential" or "he's the most charming" they should look at character, intelligence, consistency and leadership ability. Someone who quietly practices their religion by following Christian principals in their life. Someone who has dedicated their life to helping others. I looked at Ron Paul, alone on the Hill for twenty years, refraining from any vote that was unconstitutional, scolding congress for ignoring the Supreme Law of the Land and I saw him last week in Miami telling a room full of shocked Cubans that he, if president would end the Cuban embargo that has not achieved its goal in 45 years. Rolling Stone Magazine's article was titled "Ron Paul Has Huge Cojones". In these trying times that is a characteristic that I want in a president.

I watched the debate and the one thing I noticed was that they were all trying to sound more like Ron Paul. The Constitution, smaller government, less taxes, the Federal Government out of education, were issues that were the talk of the day. Issues "borrowed" from Dr. Paul. The media is hyping the preacher man, Elmer (Gantry) Huckabee because he will never be elected president and the media monopoly wants Hillary to win. Elmer Huckabee is the former governor of the most corrupt "good old boys" state in the South. He will never survive close scrutiny and he will not get it unless he is the nominee. This is a man that destroyed 300 state owned computer hard drives to keep his secrets safe. Anyone that thinks that that his candidacy isn't being driven by out side sources, (not divine intervention) is naive. Media manipulation is easily achieved when trying to sway the uninformed. That is why people should not vote for someone because "he looks presidential" or "he's the most charming" they should look at character, intelligence, consistency and leadership ability. Someone who quietly practices their religion by following Christian principals in their life. Someone who has dedicated their life to helping others. I looked at Ron Paul, alone on the Hill for twenty years, refraining from any vote that was unconstitutional, scolding congress for ignoring the Supreme Law of the Land and I saw him last week in Miami telling a room full of shocked Cubans that he, if president would end the Cuban embargo that has not achieved its goal in 45 years. Rolling Stone Magazine's article was titled "Ron Paul Has Huge Cojones". In these trying times that is a characteristic that I want in a president.

Does Huckabee accepting all those gifts put him in a higher tax bracket? Elite? Probably not elite because he didn't work for it, it was a gratefully received handout.

Romney seemed to stick to his normal tone but there were no major attacks as were expected against his now leading Iowa/SC rival Mike Huckabee. Huckabee sounded good but nothing out of the ordinary. The candidates seem to be comfortable with their respective campaign models and don't seem to want to change it up at all. The Republican field is still wide open but Giuliani continues to not really distinguish himself in a race where every thing he says includes three words 9/11, Hillary Clinton, or lowering taxes. Giuliani seems to think he can truly survive till Florida as he portrayed in his interview with Tim Russert on Meet the Press Sunday.

What is going to happen with the republicans...saw an interesting post by an Indian American leader seems that they have 8000 votes in both Iowa and NH...looks like they are growing influence
http://usinpac08.blogspot.com/2007/12/republican-debate-whats-point.html#links

"If Romney is such agood business man why would he spend 10 million of his own money the get a job that only pays a few hundred thousand a year??"

The answer is "service". Money is not the root of all evil. The love of money is. Romney has invested in this campaign purely because he genuinely cares about America and our future and believes he can be of service. I've heard that he won't be accepting the few hundred thousand a year.

Few men or woman in the world are not tempted by money. Greed is one of the vices of our time.

Wait, Alan Keyes is running for President? Since when?

And I think this is shaping up well for Rudy. Huck is going to knock Romney out in Iowa, a state he had to win, leaving him to settle for New Hampshire, a state he's supposed to win. South Carolina is a toss up, and Fred may have a shot.

The point is that there will not be a clear favorite going into Florida. That's Rudy's turf, and his strategy will have been proven correct provided he can hold his national lead.

Of course... who the hell knows for sure these days.

"Huckabee held his spot at the top. I am from Arkansas and can tell you he left this state in much better shape than he found it."

Some think so....some do not.

Fools And Their Rights Are Soon Parted.

Relying on emotion for judgment is detrimental.

Their is only one realist candidate running for president. Substance Over Symbolism Is Exemplified In Ron Paul.

Government does nothing well.

Socialism Sucks !!!

Those who rely on others opinions for their information are easily led.

Views Untested Are Useless.

I Vote For Virtue; I Vote For Ron Paul.

Who cares how somebody looks or what they say during a media event? If he doesn't have a record of public life and you didn't know who he was before this stupid campaign then ignore him. This is how we got the likes of Jimmy Carter. Gee, he sounded like a nice guy at the time.

While the economic conservatives do not want to nominate Huckabee, if Huckabee does get nominated they will vote for him. The alternative is Hillary/Obamma. No contest.

It's amazing how many people suddenly start criticizing Huckabee after months on the campaign. They take the bait from CNN (the Communist News Network, for those of you who are naive) and use it like an original thought, without knowing a single shred of the truth.

For those who think that Huck isn't a fiscal conservative, I'll leave you with the basics from the FairTax plan, which he supports:

1. Get rid of the IRS and with it income taxes, social security taxes, medicare taxes, corporate taxes, and capital gains taxes.
2. Implement the FairTax, a 23% sales tax on all new goods and services.
3. Every head of household will receive a check every month for the taxes on necessary spending (for family of 3 would be $472/month). Thus no one will be taxes for necessities, so the poor and lower middle class will essentially pay no taxes.

This plan was developed by a group of economic experts and universities to create the most efficient and fair way to raise taxes. It will solve the funding shortages of social security and medicare. It will also provide for unprecedented economic growth because exports will not be taxed, giving American businesses an advantage as opposed to a significant disadvantage under the current tax system. Please read the book "The FairTax Book" by Neal Boortz or go to www.fairtax.org for more information.

Louis- clearly you must be comparing Huckabee to Carter for his Southern charm and wit and not for any major polciies. Carter was an international isolationist- a "laissez-faire" type that was crushed for his stupidity as the USSR invaded Afganistan and the religious radicals overthrew the Iranian government. Huckabee is not even close. It's the media's way of painting Huckabee into an ineffectual leader similar to saying that Romney is really a closet Jew or Muslim. It's crazy. The dems are running on this same platform (er.... depending on what day of the week it is for Hillary) and they too, should get crushed for their same stupidity (as should Ron Paul).

Interesting to know about Huckabee's supposed bigotry (which I find a riot since, when he took over an all-white church and a black man wanted to attend his Church because he had heard his sermons, was rejected by the leadership and Mike told them that either they allowed him to attend Chruch or he was gone.... P.S. Several leaders in the Church left BTW because of their bigotry) by this New York Times reporter (where was his bigotry before this- he refused to comment on Mormonism?) asked him whether he Huckabee thought that Mormonism was a religion or a cult. Mike said that he did not know that much about religion and the reporter started to mention things that Mike said that he did not know about. That was when, since the reporter seemed to know more about Mormonism that Mike, he said his remark. Nice work New York Times. Great smear piece on a guy who stands up to bigots in the deep South who write his paycheck, avoids attacking candidates (ever see his website? Any attack ads? I'm waiting....) and when you get in a discussion with him, you take what he says out of context. Beauty, eh?

The problem with Mitt (hey, I like him, just not as much as Mike) is that he is the establishment. He is rich from a rich family. Good for him. How is that different from the Bush/Clinton monarchy? I can tell you that some people don't like him because of the convenience of his changes on social issues (it could be legitimate but the timing.....)- NOT because he is a Mormon-, he was pro-illegal immigration (I laugh when he attacks Huckabee on this- he should just stop talking about the issue and talk economics) and he will not energize the base. Huckabee came from nothing in life to where he is today and that cuts across party lines. Just my take.

I didn't even see this debate but I noticed Huckabee stealing Ron Paul's idea about eliminating IRS on previous one. Ron Paul has to start calling these chumps out on this and be more forceful in the debates. He needs to show he can mop the floor with these guys on all areas of economic and social policy. Take the gloves off. He needs to show physical confidence and make the other guys look flatfooted and outdated. He needs to remind the audience and questioners every chance he gets about these guys stealing his ideas.

You guys all sound like a bunch of Democrats. You all believe in something different with one exception. That is that some political savior could come along and create the political dreamland you've been pining for. As long as you can promote his personal majesty enough to get others to vote for him. What was that whole constitutional thing about power, and how it corrupts everyone? I guess in the 21st century we're not subject to such foolishness; men have evolved, I mean look at Hillary. Wow I'm so happy all I need to do is find someone to believe in and promote them as hard as I can: The solution to all our problems.

Romney clearly won the debate.

I watched the debate, I live in Iowa, I was supporting Huckabee before, and I'm still supporting him after the debate. I don't think this debate is going to suddenly cause Huckabee supporters to become Romney people. It's a two-man race in Iowa, and Romney didn't take Huckabee down. Huckabee won the debate for that reason.
The Fox News "focus group" wasn't helpful, because they said they were supporting Giluani and Romney before the debate - Giluani doesn't have support in Iowa. My guess is they were liberal Republicans, and didn't respond well to Huckabee saying that his faith defines him.
Huckabee is the real social conservative in the race, and everybody knows it. That's what the media is attacking him so much.

I am reading all these posts and alot of you guys are saying everyone is trying to sound like Ron Paul. Not true. Fred Thompson started talking about these issues long before he entered the race. He is a true conservative, one who has not flip flopped on the issues. As you all saw tonight, he says it like it is and speaks his mind come hell or highwater. I urge you to read his positions and policies at Fred08.

Wow, do people only watch the debates or blog for candidate information? Debates are contrived performances with no time to explain answers. The best part was when all the candidates refused to be pigeon-holed with a straw-vote on global-warming.

FYI: Huckabee didn't pardon the rapist. Arkansas doesn't give that power to the governor. The Clinton-appointed parole board did that dirty-work.

The internet gives us access to real information. Don't fall for main-stream media talking heads or sound-bites. Suggestion: Visit FairTax.org for yourself.

BTW, Huckabee knows that the government can't make us well. That's our responsibility. I'd love to see Huck as president with Ron Paul still in Congress. We need both branches of government to make real change.

Paul for Ideas and Mitt as VP.. Mitt is a very good at getting people to work together.. Without Paul as President you will be stuck with a crowd that wants to make themselves more powerful. House and Senate pay roll backs might be a good faith starting point. If Paul does what I think he will do this weekend then he should get an economic team together. In my mind there are statesmen out there that would support Ron..

1. Romney looked and acted Presidential. He was sharp. He couldn't go after Huckabee because the smarmy Lefty moderator ruled immigration out of bounds and 2/3rds of her stupid questions allowed no avenue of attack. But Romney's answers were substantive and well laid out.

2. God that moderator sucked. I didn't think anything could be worse than the setup CNN did against Republicans with planted questions - but no one reckoned on this lame bitch Carolyn Washburn being the one and only person. She also talked over the responses and tried to stop candidates in mid-sentence even when they were well before their 30 second or 60 second limit.
God, she sucked.

3. Fred Thompson came alive. Just when you thought he was ready to head back to Hollywood and toss this cheap gig - he delivers the snappy one liners some morons think is the whole criteria on how someone "wins" a long debate. But he wasn't asleep at least and actually had the best thoughts on the economy, better than even Romney's intelligent responses.

4. Huckabee just had to stand there and be nice. The debate rules ensured no one could really challenge him.

5. Allan Fucking Keyes? WTF?? What's next, Sharpton popping in on the Democrats?

6. Giuliani and McCain had bad nights, again.

7. 'Bout time for Hunter and Tancredo to head off. This field is too big to get thoughtful answers out of the frontrunners on time constraints, and will disserve the public until you get a managable number of Candidates. And if Thompson, McCain, or Giuliani drop out if they conclude they have no credible shot, Ron Paul should be dragged off in fairness as well, screaming with his fingers clawing at the carpet to remain...

Huckabee is phase one of the Christian right taking over the GOP and I love every second of it.

Speaking as a former New England liberal and atheist who is now a conservative Christian, I support Huckabee. The most telling trait: how much the elites on the right hate him.

As we saw with Bush, it is not the case that the Christian right has "hijacked" the Republican party. The truth is the other way around. Until Huckabee. That is why evangelical pets of secular elites, like Robertson and Buchanon, are supporting other candidates.

That is starting to change. Evangelicals are making their mark on the power elites in America. Christian philosophers are taking over the home ground of atheism. Christian anthropologists are taking anthropology back from atheist moral relativists. Christian politicians are taking America away from secular elites.

this is in response to Mark. The easiest way to get rid of the IRS, cut taxes and still be able to afford things is by going to the fairtax. just check out fairtax.org and read up. Did you even know it costs the IRS 3/4 of a trillion dollars to run every year?? did you know the IRS tax code is 60,000 pages??? did you know the tax code changes on average of once every 12 hours??? the IRS is the biggest waste of money out there only to create loop holes. Dont be so quick to judge that getting rid of the IRS isnt possible.

We live in a diverse, pluralistic society and all of these cretins (Paul, perhaps, excluded) are pandering to the narrowest segment of it; white, Christian(ist) fundamentalists. Just look at them! Nothing but old white men flapping their wattles, trying to look and sound "presidential", whatever that means anymore after the last horrific seven years of Bush. And people are actually taking any of them seriously! My gawd, we have become a nation of loonies, just like Justin above. I guess we have the government we deserve. Let's elect a guy who doesn't believe in evolution! Yeah, that's the ticket. Maybe he'll divine entrails when forming foreign policy! Justin and those like him would love it! No wonder American high school students are losing the battle in science and math education to some third world countries. A nation of Huckabees and Justins and we'll soon be back in the Bronze Age. Idiots, and proud of it! Simply beyond words...

I do, indeed, support

Dr. Paul for US President.

Due to 'sore-loser' laws, it is very unlikely, Ron Paul will mount a 3rd party run.

The polls are misleading. I am a faculty member at a local college here in Madison, WI. I am in my 40's and have no land line-cell only. I have friends in their 50's and 60's who also support Ron Paul. It is not just the 'disaffected youth'.

I see him as the only hope for a return to what made The United States great- just that- the UNITED States. We were formed as a Republic. By all definitions we are now an empire.

Empires do not persevere. I am deeply concerned for this country and the world. I would suggest attempting to read newspapers outside of the Western Hemisphere. The move towards Globalization is outlined in

many official documents from the CFR, TLC, and the Project for a New American Century Manifesto:

Rebuilding America's Defenses: Strategy, Forces and Resources For a New Century-

(http://www.newamericancentury.org/publicationsreports.htm)

certainly one of the scariest documents I have ever read.

3 days ago, the most popular news story in the world (virtually un-reported in the Western MSM)was that Iran stopped accepting US dollars for oil from China, Japan and other countries that hold more US currency than our own country does. What are China and Japan going to do with their immense US cash holdings, if they were to dump it on

the open market, we would spiral into an economic depression that would make the 30's look like boom times.

The reality is quite scary.

Dr. Ron Paul has a solution to these problems; a Jeffersonian foreign policy, a smaller less-obtrusive Federal government and a return to sound (not fiat) currency.

President Ron Paul. Admit it, it sounds right.

Huckabee speaks with soundbites not substance. Everyone else is starting to sound like Ron Paul. I guess freedom is popular with the candidates as well.

Huckabee speaks with soundbites not substance. Everyone else is starting to sound like Ron Paul. I guess freedom is popular with the candidates as well.

Today is a perfect date and time to know whom your creator is and what the Bible says about becoming a Christian and going to Heaven....The only way!

Plan of Salvation
I John 5:13
“These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life...”
First, you must realize that God‘s Word says we are all sinners and our sin has separated us from God.

Romans 3:23
“For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God”
Romans 3:10
“As it is written, there is none righteous, no, not one.”
No one is perfect. No one has lived up to God‘s perfect standard.
Second, you must realize that as a sinner you owe a penalty.

Romans 6:23
“For the wages (payment) of sin is death...”
This death is described in the Bible as the second death of the lake of fire - eternal separation from God.
Revelation 20:14, 15
“And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death. And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.”
Third, you must realize that Jesus Christ, God‘s perfect sacrifice, has already paid our sin debt.

Romans 5:8
“But God commendeth (proved) his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.”
II Corinthians 5:21
“For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.”
You must realize that Jesus Christ was not a sinner and that God took all of our sins and placed them on Jesus at the cross.
Fourth, you must receive by faith the Lord Jesus Christ as your personal Saviour and receive what he did for you at Calvary on the cross.

Romans 10:9
“That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.”
Romans 10:13
“For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.”
To believe on the Lord Jesus means that you accept the following: that you are a sinner; that as a sinner, you owe a sin debt; that Jesus Christ died on the Cross and shed his blood to pay the debt you owe; that only by trusting in Him and Him alone can you be saved.

Friend, why not secure an eternal home by trusting in Jesus now and pray...

Dear Jesus, I know that I am a sinner, and that I deserve to pay my own sin debt. I believe you died for me, paying that debt. I do now put my faith totally in you alone to save me. Please, forgive me of my sins and give me a home in Heaven. Thank you for saving me and making me your child. Amen

Congratulations!!! Your are now a Son of God!
You and God can only know and testify that you meant that prayer just now.....

scary stuff:
"When we make a mistake, we do it together, as the United States of America!"--Huckabee
No one who has made such an asinine statement should ever be allowed into the White House.
"Mitt Romney looks presidential! He's my favoritest candidate of all time!"
Guess you folks would have passed on John Adams.
Go Ron Paul!!!!! If he looses, get ready for the American Gulag.

Mike did a fine job on the debates. He even apologized (unnecessarily) for the fact he stated about the Mormons.
Yes, they do indeed believe Jesus and Satan are brothers.
Take a look for yourself:
http://www.lds.org/library/display/0,4945,11-1-13-6,00.html

It's fun to imagine Christ himself up there on stage with the rest of the GOP pretenders. Of course, he would be crucified (metaphor intended) running in the Republican primary. Not Christianist enough. The minute he said that we should clothe the poor and feed the hungry, to love our enemies, he would be run out of the hall on a rail. Might not even get out alive.

"A vote for Paul is also a vote for Hillary"

I had to comment on that.

Paul would clean the floor with Hillary. She's nothing more than another Neocon. The only way she's different than George W. Bush is she's supposedly female.

Other than that, they are clones. They both got into office by being related to a President that wasn't woefully incompetent, and that ends their entire resume of competence.

To all of the Ron Paul doubters...Why is it - I keep hearing that he is so "uncompromising"- That he is "too idealistic" -That he says "Crazy stuff"

Interesting that Dr. Paul gets so much attention on the blogs but is treated as a fringe candidate by the larger media. I guess they assume that there are actually just a small number Paul supporters and they spend all of their waking hours looking for blogs on which to post comments. I would love to see Paul do finish in the top three in Iowa - the media might have a tough time dealing with that.

As to Paul vetoing every piece of legislation that comes across his desk - not a bad idea. Gerald Ford did that to great effect. I would like to see the Feds govern LESS.