The Credentials Committee

Assuming that Florida and Michigan Democrats do not submit new delegate selection plans to the Democratic national committee, their plea to seat their delegations will fall on the ears of the DNC's committee on credentials.

The chairs of the committee are all veterans of the Clinton administration in some way: Alexis Herman, James Roosevelt, Jr. and Eliseo Roques-Arroyo: this led to certain conspiracy theories. But all three have maintained their neutrality; there are many Clinton officials supporting Obama, and it's hard to find prominent Dems who didn't play some role in the Clinton administration.

Anyway, Mr. Dean has not packed the committee with Clinton loyalists. He's packed the committee with, well, Dean loyalists. Those of us who covered the Dean campaign will be familiar with many of the names:

Kate O'Connor, his gubernatorial chief of staff and campaign senior adviser; Bob Rogan, a campaign deputy manager who worked closely with current DNC executive director Tom McMahon; Kathy Hoyt, another former chief of staff to Dean in Vermont; Jane Stetson, a Democratic fundraiser from Vermont; Dr. Dean's college roommate, Dr. Ralph Dawson; Adelita Grijalva, daughter of Rep. Raul Grijalva (D-AZ), an early Dean endorsee; Scott Maddox, a former chair of the Florida Democratic Party who supported Dean and who warred with the current regime at the Florida Democratic Party; William Strauss, a Massachusetts state representative who was one of Dean's earliest campaign endorsee; Tina Flournoy; a longtime Dean adviser; and many others.

Some of the members of the committee have allegiances to the candidates: Mr. Beyer raises money for Barack Obama; Flournoy is one of Clinton's top outside advisers. She also happens to be on the party's rules and bylaws committee.

But most are loyal to Dean. And Dean's overwhelming priority is to maintain the integrity of the rules.

The members of the committee are:

Dean Aguillen
Don Beyer
Jose Ceballos
Ralph Dawson
Sheila Dixon, Mayor
Christopher Edley, Jr.
Hartina Flournoy
Maryscott "Scotty" Greenwood
Janice Griffin
Laura Harris
Kathy Hoyt
Carol Juneau, State Senator
Scott Maddox
Iman Malik Mujahid
Adelita Grijalva
Maria Neira
Kate O'Connor
Carol Pensky
Bob Rogan
Leila Sahar
Marc Stanley
Michael Steed
William Straus, State Representative

Comments

I read somewhere - definitely on Slate and other places as well - that the credentials committee would be controlled by the candidate with the most pledged delegates. Hence this whole Florida/Michigan thing would become moot. (If Obama had enough of a delegate lead to seat them, he would. If his lead was slim, he wouldn't. If Hillary had enough pledged delegates, then it wouldn't even matter anymore, and she'd seat them.)

Posted by Margaret | March 6, 2008 9:27 AM

Obama is our Savior. Voters in Texas, Ohio, and Rhode Island have shown their arrogance by not supporting Obama. He is already the winner, there is no need for further so called "elections". States like Wisconsin and Missouri made Michelle proud and then Texas and Ohio brought shame on all of us, how can we redeem ourselves in Michelle's eyes? Must we continue to oppress, as she was oppressed at Princeton and Harvard?

Posted by Obamamania | March 6, 2008 9:56 AM

Thanks, Marc. Very useful stuff.

Margaret - Marc has listed the definite members of the credentials committee. Additional members will be added based on the final pledged delegate ratio between Clinton and Obama.

Posted by John | March 6, 2008 10:00 AM

Ah, gotcha. Thanks John.

Posted by Margaret | March 6, 2008 10:12 AM

Ha! I never thought I'd be thrilled to see Kate O'Connor's name again.

Posted by Joe Drymala | March 6, 2008 10:40 AM

I'd be interested in seeing a history of previous credentials committee actions similar to these MI and FL problems. I understand two delegations were not seated in 1956, and there have been other similar cases. Do we know where to find such a history?

Posted by Will | March 6, 2008 11:49 AM

Good for Dean. The top people do seem to keep sending a consistent "we're going to be playing by the rules already in place" message.

Posted by Deborah | March 6, 2008 11:52 AM

Marc: as John points out, additional members will be selected based on the candidates' performances. Specifically, it's based on a mix of popular vote totals in the primaries, and the equation for At Large delegate election in the caucuses.

But the point is: there are 161 more members to be added to the Committee, and doing the rough math, Obama will be very likely to control the majority of them.

Posted by along | March 6, 2008 12:53 PM

Would all of this argument about delegate count be going on today if Hillary had won 24 States, led by a popular vote count of 650,000, and 101 more delegates! America be serious! We see where all this is coming from or going to! What I have learned in this country is that conviction and emotion play different roles when it comes to choosing candidates as different as Obama and Clinton. But one thing is certain. The sunami of backclash that will result from an "unfair" and "manipulated" outcome by the democratic party would not only guarantee a loss in this year's presidential election, but totally reinforce the lack of trust in the democratic process by its young population for a long long time.

Posted by Bon | March 6, 2008 12:56 PM

Solution to the MI and FL delegation mess. Split all the delegates from MI and FL 50/50... All the Delegates from those states will be happy to go to the convention.

Posted by joel | March 6, 2008 1:13 PM

Not for nothing, but Adelita Grijalva's Dad is an Obama endorser. Hard to see her putting Pop's pick out to pasture on a technicality...

Posted by Denny Crane | March 6, 2008 1:59 PM

This is very informative, so thank you so much. This process must be perceived as equal and fair. I can't imagine how furious most Democrats would be if the rules were changed now to favor one candidate after ALL states knew the score. I like the 50/50 seating so the delgates could go to the convention.

Posted by Susan | March 6, 2008 3:07 PM

I support Sen. Obama and would not vote for Sen. Clinton in November. I am not alone. She is not the right package for the job, domestically or globally. She lies is mean-spirited, divisive and self-serving. She believes she deserves the job. None of these recommend her.

To be fair, I recommend allocating the MI and FL delegates evenly between the two candidates. Both states must be represented at the convention and neither candidate should be favored.

For 2012, I recommend changing the DNC rules: (1) winner take all by state and (2) revising whatever rule allowed MI and FL into their current compromised positions.

Finally, not to put too pragmatic a point on it, Obama can beat McCain. Bottom line.

Posted by Linda | March 6, 2008 3:26 PM

I live in Michigan, Detroit to be exact. Arbitrarily splitting the delegates 50/50 is even worse than denying us our vote in this incredibly crucial process.

I didn't do anything wrong, Howard Dean, so stop hiding behind some lame attempt at a power struggle and let my vote be heard. Don't blame me for a decision I had no part in making, and can't take any immediate or relevant steps to overturn.

We need a new election and if the DNC doesn't want to pay for it, they can have my pathetic alleged tax rebate check to help defray costs. Having a say in who's going to fix the mess Dubbya got us into is a lot better way to spend this bribe from him.

Posted by Janet Vandenabeele | March 6, 2008 3:38 PM

I live in Michigan, Detroit to be exact. Arbitrarily splitting the delegates 50/50 is even worse than denying us our vote in this incredibly crucial process.

I didn't do anything wrong, Howard Dean, so stop hiding behind some lame attempt at a power struggle and let my vote be heard. Don't blame me for a decision I had no part in making, and can't take any immediate or relevant steps to overturn.

We need a new election and if the DNC doesn't want to pay for it, they can have my pathetic alleged tax rebate check to help defray costs. Having a say in who's going to fix the mess Dubbya got us into is a lot better way to spend this bribe from him.

Posted by Janet Vandenabeele | March 6, 2008 3:39 PM

I BELIEVE THAT THE FLORIDA AND MICHIGAN DELEGATES SHOULD COUNT AS THEY ARE. TO DISINFRANCHISE OVER 5 MILLION PEOPLE BECAUSE HOWARD DEAN IS SUCH A STICKLER FOR THE RULES IS JUST UNFAIR. HOW D0ES THE DEMOCRATIC NATIONAL COMMITTEE THINK THAT THE DEMOCRATS CAN WIN IN THE GENERAL ELECTION IF THEY DO NOT INCLUDE FLORIDA, ONE OF THE BIGGEST PRIZES OF ALL!?! IF THEY ARE SO CONCERNED WITH USING THE MONEY THAT THEY HAVE TO DO A DO-OVER IN THESE STATES THEY NEED TO UNDERSTAND THAT ALL OF THE MONEY THAT THEY SPEND ON THE GENERAL ELECTION WILL BE WORTHLESS IF THE FLORIDIANS AND MICHIGANS DECIDE TO BOYCOTT THE GENERAL ELECTION AND ALLOW THE REPUBLICAN NOMINEE JOHN MCCAIN TO WIN THE GENERAL ELECTION.

Posted by JENNIFER | March 6, 2008 3:46 PM

I'm from Florida. Howard Dean chose to come down on Florida & Michigan much harder than the Republican Committee came down on these states.

Dean had the same choices and he chose the most harse penalty he could on over 5 million people. This goes beyond egos and politics and whoever your candidate is.

Most of us were Republicans years ago and are beginning to see a big difference in these two parties egos.

Mr. Dean should be removed for his extreme punishment. 1.7 million showed up at the poles...a record here.

What makes it worse, has been the ridicule and name calling from the DNC, Barack Obama and his supporters because Hillary Clinton won the election. Calling us renegades and mentioning Florida in his speeches following wins. Who's gonna stop us? Florida? Over national TV.

Now tell me...do you think we are going to vote for him if he wins the nomination? We will lapse back to our conservative ways after this treatment by the Democratic party.

I would rather not seat any delegates than to give any to Obama and his supporters.

Posted by Kate | March 6, 2008 6:10 PM

By the way. We've had Obama's national campaign ads here and he's come in for the big $$ fund raisers. They do put it on the news. We read the papers and watch the debates and you can't miss the press and their nightly bias-go-round.

It's impossible to escape the election hype even with lock down by the DNC. We made an informed decision here in our choice for our nominee. I think a better decision than some states. We were not influenced by negative flyers, TV ads, fancy speeches, and numerous other unnecessary tidbits. This part was nice actually.

We had a major issue on our ballot on taxes that garnered more interest. Anyone that didn't vote was the loser in more ways than one. On every news show we were told vote, vote, vote, vote.

In other words anyone who didn't wasn't going to anyway.

Like has been mentioned, I and those I spoke with never realized that the Democratic party wouldn't count our votes.

You of the Committee if you are listening...please find another way to punish leaders and elected officials that you get ticked at. This is 3rd word and the worst thing I've experienced with my country.

I will always remember you.

Posted by Kate | March 6, 2008 6:39 PM

Mr Dean was nearly ousted from the DNC Chair, too bad he wasn't. He caused this trouble with Florida and Michigan voting Democrats, he is the one he never played by the rules. The vote should be counted as voted and the delegates should be given to the winner of these elections (Hillary Clinton). Florida and Michigan are part of U.S.A. as the rest of the states they should never be disenfranchised. Clinton Supporter

Posted by Carmen zuk | March 6, 2008 8:03 PM

Mr Dean was nearly ousted from the DNC Chair, too bad he wasn't. He caused this trouble with Florida and Michigan voting Democrats, he is the one he never played by the rules. The vote should be counted as voted and the delegates should be given to the winner of these elections (Hillary Clinton). Florida and Michigan are part of U.S.A. as the rest of the states they should never be disenfranchised. Clinton Supporter

Posted by Carmen zuk | March 6, 2008 8:04 PM

Mr Dean was nearly ousted from the DNC Chair, too bad he wasn't. He caused this trouble with Florida and Michigan voting Democrats, he is the one he never played by the rules. The vote should be counted as voted and the delegates should be given to the winner of these elections (Hillary Clinton). Florida and Michigan are part of U.S.A. as the rest of the states they should never be disenfranchised. Clinton Supporter

Posted by Carmen zuk | March 6, 2008 8:04 PM

Mr Dean was nearly ousted from the DNC Chair, too bad he wasn't. He caused this trouble with Florida and Michigan voting Democrats, he is the one he never played by the rules. The vote should be counted as voted and the delegates should be given to the winner of these elections (Hillary Clinton). Florida and Michigan are part of U.S.A. as the rest of the states they should never be disenfranchised. Clinton Supporter

Posted by Carmen zuk | March 6, 2008 8:05 PM

I'm a 55 year old life-long Rhode Island Democrat and have always wondered why my party would allow Iowa & NH to be first in the selection of our candidate. Iowa is almost always a red state and NH is the New England conservatives (republican) retirement state which also goes red most of the time. These states don't even come close to providing a crossection of the country, let alone the ideals or platform of the Democratic Party.

Whats up with the Open and Modified Caucuses?! In Texas a man desribed the one he attended as similar to a "prison riot". Come on Democrats lets' go with the most important element of our democracy; THE PRIVATE VOTE.

Also, I don't mind our candidate trying to pick up Republican votes in the General Election but the motive for the crossover is very suspect in the Primary. Democrats deserve a CLOSED PRIMARY.

Posted by Rob | March 7, 2008 10:49 AM

I have decided that, if the Michigan and Florida delagates are seated in their current configuration, I will permanently withdraw from a very active membership in the Democratic Party and will very actively encourage fellow Dems to do so, as well. I've given this extremely serious thought. My reasoning is that this situation is absurd on so many levels -- Why didn't the "disenfranchised public" raise a ruccous long ago -- did they not notice names missing from the ballot -- why was Hillary Clinton's name allowed to remain on the ballot, and on and on. Basically, I need to find my own integrity and enjoy it again before I die. I thought it was gone when I came back for more, after the Supremes put George Bush into the White House. Now I find myself "hoping for the best" in a situation which is clearly corrupted. I'm smart, but really tired. Politics is for those who can set aside logic, long for power, forget their own pristine philosophies to sleep-with-their-own-devils for a percieved greater good. Not a very pretty profile of a huiman being.

Give this election some thought and decide how much longer you're going to encourage a broken system and a bankrupt morality.Sorry to be so blunt, but maybe it's time.

Pica

Posted by Pica | March 7, 2008 3:50 PM

You people are insane...When MI and FL elections were held, Obama had not even hit full stride yet, he was not nearly as well known to a lot of people as he is now. Your STATE elected officials decided to move the elections up KNOWING the rules would be broken, and that the consequences would be NO DELEGATES. Why are you whining now? They knew the rules and broke them. If you want a new election/caucus pay for it. That's your punishment for ignoring the DNC's rules put in place ALMOST 2 YEARS AGO. Don't you also find it suspect that clinton wasnt' even complaining about your two states BEFORE when she was winning? Do you honestly think she'd be saying what she's saying if she was up 150 delegates? You guys are so full of it...I feel ashamed to live in a country with so many biased/ignorant people that can't see the difference between Fair and Unfair if it smacks them in the face.

Posted by Stephen Z | March 7, 2008 5:38 PM

StephenZ,

Our election was moved up one week from what the rules considered ok. His stride wouldn't be any different than his was in Iowa, NH or South Carolina etc. The point doesn't make sense. We knew him better than those early states did.

I don't care what your or the DNC's opinion is anymore. I will speak out about my right to vote for my representation. Don't tax me if I can't vote!

This is an foolish harsh penalty from ambitious, ego driven politicians. You Stephen are insane and all of those insensitive names you call the people of Florida.

Posted by John | March 7, 2008 5:55 PM

Then vote your ELECTED local officials out, and stop crying about how your votes didn't count. That's how democracy works, your officials do STUPID things you don't agree with them, let them know you're upset in the next state held election. It's just ridiculous to say it's "democratic" to let an election, where EVERYONE knew their vote wouldn't count, now have their votes counted. Especially considering one of the two primary candidates WASN'T EVEN ON THE BALLOT IN MICHIGAN. You talk about democracy but you want to COMPLETELY undermine the idea of equal opportunity for both candidates. Besides, you still have the right to vote in the general election, that's not going to be taken away. I live in texas, my vote NEVER counts in the primaries aside from this year. So please save your sob story...it's getting so old.

Posted by Stephen Z | March 7, 2008 6:01 PM

Stephen,

They haven't come up for re-election yet. I'm not crying...it's outrage. Michigan is Michigans' business. I am concerned about what is in front of my nose here in Florida. You are so uninformed. Maybe you should learn how to change things in Texas
before you talk about the people of Florida.

You are what is referred to as a divider...there is no reasonable conversation to be had only name calling and more degradation.

This is not good for your Obama. Call his office and learn how to talk to people instead of using heavy-handed shame techniques.

Posted by John | March 7, 2008 6:19 PM

Name calling? When did i call you ANY name? i told you to stop crying. Texas NEVER has any say in ANY primary aside from this year. Do Texans whine about it CONSTANTLY, no. I'm just sick of you people complaining about something your own state decided to do. Instead of blaming your LOCAL officials, you try to blame the DNC, who did nothing more than set the rules your own state AGREED upon over a year and a half ago. And on top of that, instead of proposing a FAIR plan for a revote, you ask for the delegates to be seated even though the election was COMPLETELY unfair in favor of HIllary Clinton. You should move to Russia, that sounds more like your brand of democracy...

Posted by Stephen Z | March 7, 2008 6:23 PM

Pica,

My understanding is that Obama and Edwards with drew their names while working Iowa to show support and not lose Iowas support.

It worked Obama finished 1st, Edwards 2nd and Hillary with her name still on the ballot lost the vote miserably and came in 3rd. It was kind of ballot blackmail.

Posted by John | March 7, 2008 6:25 PM

Stephen said:
You people are insane...

You guys are so full of it...I feel ashamed to live in a country with so many biased/ignorant people that can't see the difference between Fair and Unfair if it smacks them in the face.

I say:
Stephen you seem to just want to complain about other people trying to right something they had no say in. If you can't help us...why don't you, Obama and the DNC just be quiet. I'm asking for some assistance not Obama supporter smack downs. Like the Lady above I've heard Obama say some pretty negative things that he didn't think we would see or hear and that is a very bad example and political suicide.

Maybe read Hillarys or McCains site.

Posted by John | March 7, 2008 6:38 PM

For the clear thinking and non-biased Democrats in this group. The truth is that any one of the candidates that the Democrats fielded in the beginning of the Presidential Season would make fine US Presidents. There are probably ~1,000 people in this country who have the judgment, experience, and intellectual ability to succeed as US President (I don't consider our present President one of these qualified people). If you are a Democrat, either Obama or Clinton would be fine... Really... It's going to be okay... Some people have had old or recent grudges against the Clintons. Some people have trouble with strong women figures but some folks oppose her because she is as polarizing for Republicans and the Right as Rush Limbaugh is to the Left. Many folks folks are drawn to seemingly less polarizing rhetoric and history of Obama or McCain.

Some folks don't want Obama because of the experience issue but let's be real...If we really wanted experience, there was Chris Dodd and others hoping to get picked.

Apart from differences in style, there are no differences between the two: it's an Oscar Meyer beef hot dog vs Hebrew National beef hot dog. Unfortunately, race and gender are making people act crazy... making them vote for or against a candidate because of their race or gender. Is he a Muslim? What if he starts giving away all our tax monies to other blacks) Is she a "rhymes with witch"? Can I take her female histrionics for four years?

For real Democrats, rational Democrats: either Hillary or Obama will do fine... It will not be the end of the world if either one gets selected. Let's just control the tempers and control the rhetoric, we have a great chance to take over the White House in November. Let's not blow it.

Posted by Julio | March 8, 2008 7:48 PM

Hi! I'm from Florida so I thought I'd briefly weigh in. According to the Tampa Tribune a few weeks ago, a big majority of Floridians do NOT want the vote counted. I do not want the vote counted. My canidate did not have the opportunity to get his message out. He was not even on the ballot in Michigan. The rules were clear; the consequences crystal clear. Florida and Michigan made their choice.

Posted by Florida Obama Mama | March 9, 2008 8:59 AM

I don't like seeing voters disenfranchised, and clearly it wasn't the fault of rank and file Democrats that their state parties tried to jump the gun on NH. And furthermore, I think it is ridiculous that NH and IA get to be the lifelong, protected, self-appointed arbiters of who we send into the general election.

That said, all parties involved knew at the time that these were the rules, and the FL and MI parties knew what the consequences were. To try to change the rules midstream, outside the normal process, is little different than when George W. Bush puts his little "fingers crossed - I might not follow this one" notes at the bottom of bills he signs into law.

As for people who fear - or even say they are examples of - some looming mass "protest" in the fall from FL and MI Democratic voters, in which they will either vote for McCain or sit the election out (thus helping McCain tacitly)... are you telling us for the record that nursing your wounded sense of self-importance takes precedence for you over getting the country going in a positive direction? If that is the case then truly I feel sorry for you and your fragile ego. And I feel sorry for the families of our soldiers who will be dying in John McCain's Hundred Years War in Iraq during the coming decades. And for the women who may be getting back alley abortions due to the ultra-right-wing justices McCain will surely appoint to shore up his relationship with the medeival wing of his party.

But if your personal sense of importance truly is paramount, then by all means go for it and send the country further down the sewer. All because your state parties had a run-in with the national one. Punish us all, and feel your power to be destructive. That's the mindset of a school shooter, by the way. But I guess you can go that way if you choose to.

Posted by Mark | March 12, 2008 5:26 PM

I don't blame Floridians for being mad. I'm from Michigan and I'm mad too. But be mad at the right people. Yes, the Republicans in FL voted to change primary date, but the elected dems overwhelmingly joined them in it. Also, your governor who is so concerned for your right to vote now could have vetoed it then. They all knew that they were playing craps with your right to vote. Did you teach your kids to change the rules in the middle of the game if they were losing? Senator Clinton gave her word of HONOR not to "participate" in Fl and MI primaries. Is her word of honor no good? In MI nobody asked me either, but I know sportsmanship from cheating. Howard Dean didn't come up with these rules all by himself. The rules were voted on by democratic parties in all states--including FL and MI--and were agreed to.
I have a candidate that I prefer, but I haven't lost site of who the real opponent is. Do we really want four more years of Bush-like government? I donate to my favorite campaign. Many of us make phone calls to voters in other states or talk to people with a view towards the general election. Or volunteer in many ways. Or just wear a button. We aren't helpless victims and we're more alike then we are different. Let's stop our sabre rattling. Campaign for your nominee, but support your party in the end. And then whoever wins the election don't forget that we're Americans first and bi-partisan second. Egos have been running rampant, but we can choose again. Four thousand Americans are dead. Thirty thousand Americans are horribly injured. One hundred and fifty thousand Iraquis are dead and we don't even know how many have been injured. Do we really want to insist on having our own way if it means another hundred years of this? Join me as one of the disenfranchised in making the best of a bad situation by campaigning and voting responsibly.

Posted by karela | March 14, 2008 7:10 AM

Well said karela.

I was originally for Edwards, but always wondered if Obama might be a stronger choice for keeping people engaged.

Anyhow, Hillary has shown her arrogance one too many times and it is obvious that she will stop at nothing to win. So she denies her promises and fans the flames of 'disenfranchisement'. My opinion has always been largely the same as yours.

The Florida House Voted 118-0, the Senate there voted 37-2. Yes there are more Republicans in those offices, but it isn't exclusively Republican. Newspaper articles after the Florida House voted had Democratic lawmakers gloating about how they just made Florida relevant.

Also, most may not realize this, but there are more
registered Democrats than Republicans in Florida. Sounds to me like they are more to blame for their dilemma than they care to admit. Guess they needed to make sure they got more of their own elected.

Finally - Hillary harps about disenfranchising voters from two states - what about all of us watching the retched crap from 48 other states?

Posted by tpartier | March 16, 2008 2:38 AM

karela said:
Senator Clinton gave her word of HONOR not to "participate" in Fl and MI primaries. Is her word of honor no good? In MI nobody asked me either, but I know sportsmanship from cheating. Howard Dean didn't come up with these rules all by himself. The rules were voted on by democratic parties in all states--including FL and MI--and were agreed to.

John said:
What the candidates signed were pledges saying that they would NOT campaign in Florida. That's it!!
Hillary didn't campaign here but Obama has TV ads running. We actually know what happened here. And our votes reflected that.

I will not support Obama if he wins the nomination. Not only did he campaign, but he and his supporters ACTIVELY BLOCKED any hope of a redo. Howard Dean could have penalized FL & MI as the Republican party did, but he did not he gave the harshest penalty there is. Obama Super Delegates and party elders have done everything they can to block chances of a fair election in this country and have called for Hillary Clinton to step down even though she has the same chance as Obama does. They know with counting FL & MI she is even ahead.

I will NOT support this DEMOCRATIC PARTY...no I won't. To think we will dance around the very people that represent this type of behavior is absurd. McCain is an honest man...Obama is not that and neither is this party. They will seat the delegates after the choosing is done, but it will be too late for them. The rage I feel is only fueled by the very people saying how just this is.

No, John McCain for President. I have as much compassion for the DNC and all of you as you have for me and the states of FL & MI.

Posted by John | March 31, 2008 9:54 AM

Hillary Clinton knew that MI and FL would not count when they broke the DNC rules and it was OK with her when she was ahead in the delegate count. To suggest now that punishing MI and FL for breaking the rules is somehow disenfranchising voters is quite a stretch and very dishonest. Hillary Clinton is a devisive, coniving deviant, and there is no way she should be Obama's VP. Contrary to the talking heads in the mainstream media, she has NOT earned the right to the VP spot, but has consistently done everything in her power to try to destroy Obama during this primary campaign. She has gone so far as to suggest that he would be assasinated in June, thereby giving her the Dem nomination. How despicable! This woman will do anything for power and MUST NOT BE TRUSTED!

Posted by gail | May 31, 2008 8:36 PM